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Author Topic: How "Starter Marriage" Thinks  (Read 463 times)
Daphne
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Five Star Sneetch
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« on: May 02, 2025, 09:14:58 pm »

I am going to break my silence about the internal workings of Starter Marriage, at least a little bit. I don't know how useful this will be in following the story, but I hope you'll at least find it interesting.

As someone (thank you!) noted, the choices that you make early in the game don't just affect what comes later, but what has come before. In effect, as you select choices, you are picking which story the protagonist has been in since well before the story actually began. By the end of "The Girlfriend Experience," the story has resolved itself into a handful of plots. Each plot centers around the central mystery of Starter Marriage, which is: Why did Annie leave? The plot also controls which person or people are the primary engine driving the story forward, and it's not always the protagonist.

While there are literally hundreds of parameters that are constantly changing as the story evolves, two particularly important ones are "trustworthiness" and "attentiveness." "Trustworthiness" is what it sounds like: how often does the protagonist lie or tell the truth? "Attentiveness" is, more or less, how much the protagonist displays concern about the other people in the game, especially his lovers. Of course, those aren't the only factors that control what happens in the game. Changes in the direction of the story are often based on the particular way a choice is worded, taken as a statement of what kind of person the protagonist is.

An untrustworthy protagonist doesn't just lie to other people. He lies to himself, and covers things up. This is true even though the point of view of the story is free indirect, rather than first or second person. So, yes, the protagonist will (potentially) lie to you.

The motivations of the other characters in the story also change depending on how the story evolves, and can be quite different from plot to plot.

As the story plays out (especially in the earlier parts), the choices determine what kind of person the protagonist is, and what happened in the time before the story we're looking at started. These are alternative realities: each plot is incompatible with the others.

And now I'm going to drop a few facts, just to make things even more interesting (or confuisng):

  • Allison played no part in Annie's departure.
  • The voice the protagonist hears during the night between "The Girlfriend Experience" and "Relationship Goals" is not Dante.
  • Dante never controls the protagonist in the story so far.
  • The decision as to whether or not to fly out to Annie is less important than it might initially seem.
  • There are important characters who have not even been mentioned yet.

And: There is a huge clue to what plot you are in and what it means in Phase 4.1.

Thank you for all of your kind words and attention to Starter Marriage! It's been an enormous amount of work (and even more work to come), but the reception it has had makes that entirely worthwhile.
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Daphne
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Five Star Sneetch
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Posts: 4595


Drawn and Quartered.


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« Reply #1 on: May 02, 2025, 09:32:45 pm »

Oh, right, a couple more things I wanted to mention:

Sometimes, it's obvious when a choice will affect one of the parameters.  If the protagonist evades telling Allison that it was Annie who texted at the start of the story, that has an affect on his trustworthiness.  Sometimes, it's very subtle.  Sometimes, it's impossible to tell, because you-the-player doesn't know what the truth is, but the protagonist does.  (Yes, that's extremely unfair and oh well.)

One thing that will be forever a mystery is the way those parameters control the plot. Some of it is that, like I mentioned, so many different factors go into it that it's not easy to say things like, "More trustworthy protagonists are more likely to make a successful pass at Lorelei." (I don't even know if that's true or not!)

The other reason is that, to be completely honest, this is a story not a philosophical dissertation, and I don't want anyone to be offended or to feel they have to argue with a particular decision I've made about how the personality characteristics of the protagonist affect the outcome. I don't even agree with every choice in that regard! But, you know, 11,819 lines of Python, 18,470 lines of templates, decisions had to be made.
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Daphne
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Five Star Sneetch
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Drawn and Quartered.


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« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2025, 09:38:55 pm »

Oh, and as long as we are talking about statistics… I have a 'bot that repeatedly "plays" the story looking for different paths. It's extremely handy for finding bugs, since I get a set of a huge number of different possible states.

But it never gets them all. The best I can hope for is about 95% coverage, and that's with 250,000+ playthroughs. So, there are a lot of choices in this game.
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hereno
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« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2025, 11:45:17 pm »

This is great! Thank you for writing this.

Each plot centers around the central mystery of Starter Marriage, which is: Why did Annie leave?
This might be the most surprising thing you said here. I'm not sure this question has particularly been forefront for me, though I know the protag and Lorelei occasionally talk about it. Plus, until now, rejecting Annie has seemed pretty final. I guess there's a lot more coming than I realized! (How long are you planning to develop this game for? Even the amount of content I could foresee is a lot of dev time!)

The voice the protagonist hears during the night between "The Girlfriend Experience" and "Relationship Goals" is not Dante.
Do you mean, "is not Renee"? It's a woman's voice, right? Unless there's a dark room sequence I've never seen...

Dante never controls the protagonist in the story so far.
Well, I got that one wrong. Very curious what exactly is going on after that particular dark room sequence then.

The decision as to whether or not to fly out to Annie is less important than it might initially seem.
That would track with what you said about her leaving being the central mystery.

There are important characters who have not even been mentioned yet.
I had a sneaking suspicion this was true; I only recently encountered dialogue from Lorelei that mentioned Allison might have been enslaved by someone from an office party. If there are lots of big characters we're yet to even meet, that sort of opens this game much wider than I'd been thinking about it. There's no way to figure out what's going on if I literally don't even know all the pieces yet! I guess I need to relax a bit more and just let the game unfold. (Spoiler: I will not relax a bit more lol.)
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Daphne
Publisher
Five Star Sneetch
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Posts: 4595


Drawn and Quartered.


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« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2025, 11:53:50 pm »

This is great! Thank you for writing this.

Each plot centers around the central mystery of Starter Marriage, which is: Why did Annie leave?
This might be the most surprising thing you said here. I'm not sure this question has particularly been forefront for me, though I know the protag and Lorelei occasionally talk about it. Plus, until now, rejecting Annie has seemed pretty final.

This may be giving away more than I intend, but: The importance of why Annie left and whether the protagonist ever even speaks to Annie again are not, technically, the same question.

Quote
(How long are you planning to develop this game for? Even the amount of content I could foresee is a lot of dev time!)

I try not to think about that, lest I become completely demoralized! The person whose shoulders it *really* falls, though, is Plutonian Knight, who is not only producing all the line art for SM, but is also keeping SJI going. The man is a miracle of industry, let me tell you.
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twobears
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« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2025, 11:59:46 pm »

I have occasionally wondered whether the "surprise" that Renee occasionally mentions regarding the party is that Annie will be in attendance
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ktc1221
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Two Star Sneetch
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Comics Fan


« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2025, 07:41:04 am »

Personally find this fascinating, and it does help to understand a bit. I feel like hereno particularly figured out choices impacted prior states of the protagonist character, but even I figured out that how you said things impacted choices made previously. I think the most blatant one being whether you say "text from Annie " or "Nobody important". That single line of dialogue effectively chooses polygamy or monogamy for you as the protagonist, as the next morning you will either be in the story where Lorelei is a lover still (affair) or she is just your friend (though still a lover from your past). I'm sure (we know) it impacts other things too that's just the most obvious.

I'm kinda glad you gave the numbers on what a bot does etc and just how many indidivual choices there were. I had at one point thought about cataloging each choice but always felt like there would be too many branches so to speak. Now I know there's too many branches, and it's better to make broad strokes. Ala polygamy and monogamy state, exhibitionist or private, master /slave or cuck boy to name a few.

A herculean task you've made for yourself but one I hope to see through to the end. Looking forward to 4.1, it sounds like at least some answers will be given in that update.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2025, 09:18:23 am by ktc1221 » Logged
Haight
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« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2025, 12:50:19 pm »

This definitely is interesting to hear about. More characters, though? Character bloat could get a bit crazy... exponentially branching choice trees... I'm surprised you don't force more linearity.
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"And I want to reach in to the fire of your heart/I want to program all those beats right from the start"
Flintnsteal
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« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2025, 07:53:42 pm »

The alertness point is really interesting, because to me, I was imagining some things as being like, not being concerned about them because you are causing them, stuff like Allison being more generally horny, I was envisioning a mentally of, yeah she is, that's what I've been training her to do. I imagine some stuff like that is just the inherent fact of, eventually someone needs to decide how things flow, and that won't always be the same way a person playing the game will interpret things flowing. None of this by way of trying to bash yourself Daphne or anyone else working on the project.

As an aside a like, zoomed out level understanding how those decisions work internally would be super fascinating, just cause these kinds of projects are very interesting imo.
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